#25 Why VMware Tanzu if there are soooo many open source choices?

So basically, Michael, what you do in this lovely containers world in VMware company? What is your role? So I work on the developer relations team, but as I like to, maybe this joke is getting a little tired, but like I neither talk with developers nor relate with them. And instead what I do is I talk more with, I guess you could say, I don't know if so much enterprise architects but managers and executives like people who are like programming and architecting their organization. So most of what I spend my time like on like researching and talking with people about and then like you know making all sorts of content for publishing let's call it is basically like if you want your organization to get better at doing software

Exactly. Yeah, 25th episode of evoilcast. Well, hopefully you'll get to 25,000 episodes. That would be amazing. Hopefully, you know, but I will, you know, my beard will grow a little bigger, I think. So today, with us, Michael Kotę, my name is Maciek Lelusz. I'm running the podcast over last years and we talk generally about case studies here. So we think about technology and how to use this technology in your infrastructure, in your organization. Depends, you know, on what level it's something important to be changed, right, by this technology. Names mentioned because the VMware is in the air, right? So what is Tanzu? Could you could you say to our listeners a little bit, just a brief explanation?

Więc, co masz, to wielka skomplikacja, wielka standardizacja z, jak powiedziałeś, ekosystemem wokół tego. Więc, na przykład, jeśli patrzysz na sposób Kubernetes w robieniu stacku Tanzu, gdzie budujesz na górze, wiesz, Tanzu Kubernetes, Tanzu dla operacji Kubernetes i platformę aplikacji Tanzu, a na górze, jeśli robisz, jeśli używasz frameworku Spring, jeśli robisz aplikacje Java i piszesz aplikacje Spring Boot, There is an out of the box way to do all of that, that you can start doing things rapidly. But it's been my experience that the larger the organization, for better or worse, hopefully for better, people really want to customize and tinker with things.

And the first sort of technology, like mind technology that's required is to instead of, in a classic way of IT, You think about providing services, right? Like you are shipping an image or a container or you're setting up a service for someone to use. But instead it's good to think about I am shipping a product to a customer. And the way that's important is, the distinction makes it important is that when you start thinking about developers as your customers, instead of just sort of like guaranteeing that your service is good and you provided them what you want, what they need, Instead, you start thinking about how can I solve more problems for the customers, right? Like how can I make their experience better?

So, you know, that's an example of like the infrastructure people can start like thinking about, well, how would I fix that? And on and on and on, right? Like you kind of keep finding things iteratively that to make your product, the infrastructure you're providing better. And yeah, I mean, I think Myślę, że też pytasz o to, jak rozwijać to przez resztę organizacji, aby ludzie byli świadomi i myśleli o tym. Mam na myśli dwie rzeczy. I to wraca do marketingu, o którym mówiłem. Kolejną powodą, dlaczego jest beneficjentem zacząć mało, z tylko jednogłośnymi zespołami, jest to, że bardzo prywatnie, na początku, i znowu, myślę, że to jest rolę, którą przewodnicy muszą wziąć, jest to, że budujesz,

About the tool to use? Just broadly put? First of all, it's an intriguing thought exercise that you need to start at the middle that you brought up there. I'll have to think about that. I don't think anyone ever says that. But thinking through it, there is a common pattern that happens where there will be As we would say, like a champion, like a fairly high level executive who has been given the mission, you know, from all the way to the CEO or the director or whatever, you know, and the board to, like, make things better. He's a stakeholder basically.

They also are a great source of feedback and input about what the platform should do and how it can make things better. I think this is the first change, right? You want to go for modern apps in your organization because you're feeling that push from the ecosystem of your partners, competitors, wherever. And the first thing that you change is that there is a dev role. It can happen on the level of the CEO that the guy is just pushed to be Names mentioned.

Like a very good textbook, but how do you actually apply it to what you're doing, right? And again, using your bulldozer-like probe thing, what are the unique things of your organization The unique ways that you solve and transform and change the issues that you encounter. And how can you have a system for doing that, right? And I think that's why I think people will often say, you know, like one of my former coworkers, like she famously would say, like, you know, containers aren't going to fix your broken culture, right? Which I think is true, right? You know, my, you know, addendum to that is like, but you are also going to need containers Maybe it's gonna ignite that, right? Sometimes when you're sticking to some model for many years, then some ignition, I don't know how to say it, but something from outside that makes you do it better, right?

So at least try. Michael, dziękuję bardzo za rozmowę. To było naprawdę wyjątkowe. Dzięki za twój czas. To był 25. odcinek inLeoCast i Michael Cotter był z nami. Dziękuję bardzo panu i małego dnia. Tak, dziękuję za zaproszenie. Było fajnie. Dziękuję bardzo.